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a question of feedback

  • Jun. 13th, 2006 at 12:07 AM
cali: (books)
So I pretty much missed the whole hate meme phenomena, or at least the SGA one. A lot of people have been posting their outrage, and yeah. I just don't get it (hate memes that is, not outrage) because it seems like, at least in the supernatural threads, it was all about "blah blah blah I hate this person because they write stuff I don't like and they're obviously a huge bitch because other people do like it."

Um. Way to be self-sabotaging fandom! Hating people who are actively participating in fandom just because they're participating is not going to help anything. And what's up with the personal vendettas against BNFs? There's this really nifty feature called the scroll button when you don't want to read something.

Anyway, some people defend hate memes because they're like, the only opportunity for non-BNFs to be heard and anonymous commenting levels the playing field or something. Yes, it totally sucks that lj is more of a popularity contest than a cohesive community, but seriously, if you're yourself are actually involved in fandom, can you not see the good in encouraging everyone to participate? Because it seems to me that a lot of times creative people play off of each other and encouraging that should never, ever be a bad thing. One thing I do wish though, is that some of the stuff brought up in the hate threads could actually be discussed outside of the context of petty, spiteful commentary.

[livejournal.com profile] eleveninches posted the other day, I think in response to something that came up in [livejournal.com profile] sga_hate, about authors responding to feedback. She asked if people are affected by whether or not an author responds to their feedback. While I didn't see the original threads, I imagine some of the hate was directed at several prolific authors in the sga fandom who somewhat notoriously don't respond to feedback. In response to her questions I said this about my feedback habits:

I really try to leave feedback for everything I enjoyed reading, but if it's a writer who I know doesn't respond to feedback, I usually won't bother. Above and beyond any considerations of fandom etiquette and politeness, not responding to feedback (at least to me) seems to indicate a certain level of indifference towards even getting feedback at all.

And personally, I like writing feedback, I like picking out what I loved, and telling writers exactly what worked for me. So I usually spend a good amount of time trying to construct something more than a quick "thanks!" (not that there's anything wrong with doing that, sometimes it's all I have time for too.) Fandom is a reciprocal culture, if I don't feel like the time I put into feedback is appreciated, I won't leave it. And more than that, feedback is pretty much the best opportunity for readers to interact with writers, it's how a lot of meta gets discussed, and how a lot of people meet new friends. I don't think every writer has to automatically make friends with all of their reviewers, but I think it's nice when the channels of communication are at least open to that, even if all it is is a standard thank you reply, at least that's something.

Some of the best meta discussions I've had have come out of feedback threads, [livejournal.com profile] synecdochic is especially good at fostering those sorts of conversations when she posts fanfic. I know I've gotten to be better friends with at least half of the writers on my friendslist through conversations that started with feedback. And I know not all authors are interested in that or have time for that, but at least a thank you is, I think, called for when people give you a compliment. It just feels, at worst, rude and at least, like they don't care that people have left them feedback.

(stealing [livejournal.com profile] eleveninches' questions:) What do you guys think? Does anyone think a blanketed thank you is a poor response to feedback? Do you not leave feedback if the author doesn't say thanks? Do you get annoyed seeing an author saying a standard thank you to every comment left for them? Do you not care and leave feedback regardless of the author's actions? And, because I know there are several authors on my friendslist, do you guys all respond to your feedback? Do you feel like you have to? Or that it's a waste of time when all you can really say is "thanks" 40 times?

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Comments

[identity profile] theantimodel.livejournal.com wrote:
Jun. 14th, 2006 03:16 am (UTC)
See, i tend to think of feedback as more of a compliment than a thank you. In response to [livejournal.com profile] amireal's comment above, I compared posting a story to having an art show, and I'm still pretty happy with that analogy. To me, posting a story is all about inviting a response, that's why they're posted in public with comments enabled and encouraged. If I went to an art show and complimented someone on the work they did getting the show together, I would think it was pretty rude if their only response was to give me a blank stare and walk away.

I'm not sure I would argue that authors owe their readers anything, and neither would I argue that readers owe writers feedback, but I'd definitely say that it's the polite thing to do on both sides.
[identity profile] wistful-fever.livejournal.com wrote:
Jun. 14th, 2006 03:33 am (UTC)
True. I've said it in another comment, but I'm all tangled up between writer and reader here.

As a reader, I truly do not care if someone forgets or just doesn't respond to me. It does not cross my mind at all unless a post like this comes down the metafandom pike. If I enjoyed the story, that's all I, personally, ask for. That's my opinion as a reader. I understand why other people feel differently. I just... don't necessarily agree because my opinion is so... deeply ingrained already. I don't think that anyone could convince me a writer is being rude by not giving me attention. It's just... I've already developed a bias there. *shrug*

That doesn't mean I don't try to respond to every bit of feedback left to me, even though it's inevitably hit and miss since I'm a terrible correspondent and I procrastinate. I don't do it to be polite, though. I do it because people want it, and I don't like hurting people's feelings. Sometimes I'd rather be reading that great fic other people have pimped on my f-list, especially since I have a limited amount of online time unless it's the middle of the night, but if that's the case, it'll still be there the next time I'm on, and at least I haven't alienated anyone by not replying.

Which reminds me... I have feedback on older stuff I need to reply to. ::facepalm:: I need to make a to-do list for stuff like this just to keep organized.
[identity profile] mawaridi.livejournal.com wrote:
Jun. 14th, 2006 07:45 am (UTC)
It is a good analogy in some ways, but it's not quite accurate to say that complimenting someone to their face is the same as complimenting someone through an LJ comment. Perhaps it should be, I don't know. But I would be far more offended if I offered someone a verbal compliment and was ignored than if I said "I love your work!" in an LJ comment and didn't get a reply.
[identity profile] amireal.livejournal.com wrote:
Jun. 14th, 2006 11:30 am (UTC)
*nods* I agree. It is different. And in that situation, a smile and a thank you for the compliment is usually sufficient if you don't know the person and they don't have anything specific to say about said art.

And I am a shmoozer from way back, I know this skill and I actually enjoy it for the most part. Replying to LJ feedback does not feel like shmoozing. It's this permanent record of your conversations. So on one hand you please people who check out that sort of thing because they can see your reply pattern. But those who look deeper see that there can be a pattern of "blanket thank yous" and now you've just pissed off a whole nother group of people. I gotta say though... 5 pages of comments, most of which don't have anything to respond to... what am I supposed to do?
[identity profile] theantimodel.livejournal.com wrote:
Jun. 15th, 2006 09:23 pm (UTC)
I think the proportion of people who get pissed off about blanket thank yous is a lot smaller than the proportion of fans who get turned off by an author's habitual lack of response to their readers (although I certainly don't have numbers to back me up on that.) I mean honestly, if it stresses you out don't do it. That should be the number one rule of fandom. And I don't think I've ever thought of you as an author who doesn't at least try to engage her readers so I don't think discussion is as much about whether you should feel guilty for not responding to feedback as it is about authors in general and how responses to feedback affect people's feelings. It seems like the general concensus is that some form of acknowlegement on the author's part, any acknowlegement, really, is more preferable than nothing at all.
[identity profile] theantimodel.livejournal.com wrote:
Jun. 15th, 2006 05:14 pm (UTC)
I would actually argue that it is the same, because it's the only way we do communicate on livejournal. The comments feature was specifically set up as a way for two (or more) people to directly interface with each other. It's the closest thing the internet has to face to face conversation (with the possible exception of instant messaging which is, by default, even more instant than livejournal.) The fact that we're not speaking to each other face to face doesn't mean that etiquette considerations have to fall to the wayside.

That said, I don't entirely miss your point. Because livejournal is often a series of delayed responses, I would be much less likely to notice that someone never responded to the feedback I left them. I don't keep a list of people I've feedbacked and put a check next to their name when I get a reply. But say I'm reading a story from an author whom I've read in the past and have appreciated (and I'm reading it a few days late this time) if I see that they haven't answered any of the comments they've received, it might make me think about whether I've ever heard back from them about any of the feedback I've left them. It might not start to bother me immediately, but at some point I wouldn't be able to ignore the fact that that particular author habitually ignores the piles of feedback they get. And while other people may not feel the same, one-sided communication of any sort bothers me; and an author who doesn't ever engage their readers isn't one whom I will ever feel truly excited about feedbacking. And you know, that disappoints me a lot because I really, really love fandom and fannish discussions.