Um. Way to be self-sabotaging fandom! Hating people who are actively participating in fandom just because they're participating is not going to help anything. And what's up with the personal vendettas against BNFs? There's this really nifty feature called the scroll button when you don't want to read something.
Anyway, some people defend hate memes because they're like, the only opportunity for non-BNFs to be heard and anonymous commenting levels the playing field or something. Yes, it totally sucks that lj is more of a popularity contest than a cohesive community, but seriously, if you're yourself are actually involved in fandom, can you not see the good in encouraging everyone to participate? Because it seems to me that a lot of times creative people play off of each other and encouraging that should never, ever be a bad thing. One thing I do wish though, is that some of the stuff brought up in the hate threads could actually be discussed outside of the context of petty, spiteful commentary.
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eleveninches posted the other day, I think in response to something that came up in sga_hate, about authors responding to feedback. She asked if people are affected by whether or not an author responds to their feedback. While I didn't see the original threads, I imagine some of the hate was directed at several prolific authors in the sga fandom who somewhat notoriously don't respond to feedback. In response to her questions I said this about my feedback habits:I really try to leave feedback for everything I enjoyed reading, but if it's a writer who I know doesn't respond to feedback, I usually won't bother. Above and beyond any considerations of fandom etiquette and politeness, not responding to feedback (at least to me) seems to indicate a certain level of indifference towards even getting feedback at all.
And personally, I like writing feedback, I like picking out what I loved, and telling writers exactly what worked for me. So I usually spend a good amount of time trying to construct something more than a quick "thanks!" (not that there's anything wrong with doing that, sometimes it's all I have time for too.) Fandom is a reciprocal culture, if I don't feel like the time I put into feedback is appreciated, I won't leave it. And more than that, feedback is pretty much the best opportunity for readers to interact with writers, it's how a lot of meta gets discussed, and how a lot of people meet new friends. I don't think every writer has to automatically make friends with all of their reviewers, but I think it's nice when the channels of communication are at least open to that, even if all it is is a standard thank you reply, at least that's something.
Some of the best meta discussions I've had have come out of feedback threads,
synecdochic is especially good at fostering those sorts of conversations when she posts fanfic. I know I've gotten to be better friends with at least half of the writers on my friendslist through conversations that started with feedback. And I know not all authors are interested in that or have time for that, but at least a thank you is, I think, called for when people give you a compliment. It just feels, at worst, rude and at least, like they don't care that people have left them feedback.(stealing
eleveninches' questions:) What do you guys think? Does anyone think a blanketed thank you is a poor response to feedback? Do you not leave feedback if the author doesn't say thanks? Do you get annoyed seeing an author saying a standard thank you to every comment left for them? Do you not care and leave feedback regardless of the author's actions? And, because I know there are several authors on my friendslist, do you guys all respond to your feedback? Do you feel like you have to? Or that it's a waste of time when all you can really say is "thanks" 40 times?- Mood:
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Comments
I've been answering LJ feedback individually since I moved to SGA, as a sort of experiment, but I don't think what I did before was inappropriate. It's not like I'm a feedback-answering-slacker--I don't think I *ever* failed to acknowledge a legitimate piece of email feedback. I just think it is a little disproportionate to post "Thanks!" fifty times over. I also think it may look a little weird if you engage more with some people's responses than with others; unlike with email, everyone can see who's getting more of a response, and I can see how *that* might be off-putting to a person who only gets a "Thanks!"
In a personal sense, what if boils down to is whether an author is going to care that I (or anyone else) has left them feedback. If they never respond to it, or acknowledge, in some way, that it's appreciated, I have no way of knowing whether my time was worth spending. And I think a blanket thanks answers that question just as solidly as individual replies. In a secondary sense, it also keeps communication a little more open between author and reader. As a reader, fandom participation can sometimes feel a little empty, because you're not personally contributing fanfiction, so it's always been just little extra nice to have some level of interaction with the writing half of fandom.
Okay, now for the questions: I do like to see that my comments are being acknowledged by the writer. It shows me that s/he is interesting in the writing and the feedback, the whole deal. I tend to leave shorter, more generalised reviews if I know the author isn't all that interested. It doesn't annoy or enrage me, but it makes me put less effort into reviewing. With people on my friendslist whose writing style I know, reviews can turn into analysing and criticising sessions.
Also, if the review is something like "OMG! You brought X and Y together. I love you, write more!" then what exactly is the author supposed to do? Write a 4-page essay on how character dynamics work for that particular pairing? In that case, I'd reply with a "Thanks, I like the pairing too" and be that's it.
As for my own response to reviews, well, that depends on the review. If it's just a short "Wow. Great story" I usually repond with an equally short "thank you for reading, I'm glad you liked/enjoyed it" - that's my standardised response, and it's the same for any of these types of reviews.If there is nothing else to go on, I can't start discussing things, obviously. If the reviewer remarks on specific things, I try to explain my reasons for making a character do something or having him/her say something.
On the whole I think it's only polite to respond to feedback, even if all you can say is "thank you". If there are 5 or 6 reviews in a row that I can only respond to with a short thank you, I usually try to vary my standard response a bit so it doesn't look like I copy&paste it.
The reader takes the time to comment and leave feedback, so I think the author should take the time to respond to that.
~ sera
Yeah, exactly. It's, I mean, no one has to do it, but I do think it is the polite thing to do. It seems like a lot of authors respond in kind to the feedback they get, saying a quick thanks to people who take the time to drop a quick "I enjoyed this, thank you!" and longer comments to people who give more detailed feedback. As someone who usually leaves detailed fb, I can't help but enjoy this because it can often lead to more discussion and well, isn't thank kind of the point of livejournal?
as for my feedbacking habits: if I'm aware an author doesn't respond to feedback comments (and on LJ and in fandom, word gets around, so nine times out of ten, those authors become somewhat notorious for their lack of response) then I won't leave a comment, regardless of how good/bad/whatever the story is.
I admire anyone who can write... having no such talent myself. I am also one of those people who writes paragraphs or attempts to write meaningful sentences about what the story left me feeling/thinking or the bits I loved about it. I like leaving comments and many authors on my flist always respond or leave a general comment thanking people.
I can honestly say that there is only one author in SGA whose stories I never comment, mainly because:
1) She doesn't respond to any comments people leave her,
2) She gets many comments (eg more than 50) and I'm not sure if she has the time to wade through everything and respond personally.
3) When I read her other entries, she makes comments about the comments she receives that make me feel that my comments would only serve to irritate her!
I've read that some authors complain about people saying, "Cool" or stuff like, "I'm really looking forward to your next story..." and I always try to be nice and polite, to show my admiration and appreciation of a story if I know that an author is particularly sensitive to comments and I don't know her personally, I will tend to remain silent.
Having said that, I don't always expect authors to respond because I know that sometimes, you simply run out of things to say if 100 people leave comments and especially if they leave one word sentences.
I am fairly sure I know the person you're talking about and I also, do not leave feedback for her very often. I used to, it just got to a point where there was no point for me to spend the time on it.
Also, as a very small author with a tiny output, every piece of feedback is precious, especially when I write in tiny, underground fandoms like the Vampire Chronicles. (Readers in small fandoms are always more appreciative of your work, if it's good, because it's difficult to find *any* fic, let alone good ones -- as opposed to Harry Potter or whatever, where you can't take two steps without tripping over a dozen good fics, and a dozen bad ones, too.) Not that I base my sense of self-worth on how many comments my fic gets, because really, I'm not 12 years old, but it's nice to let someone know that you appreciated them taking the time to read your work and reply.
As for leaving feedback myself, I'm kind of lazy. I know, I'm terrible. It depends on what I have to do -- if I can leave an LJ comment or a message on a review board, then I will. If I have to write an email, then I probably won't bother, because that's more effort. (The exception to that is if I'm trawling a collection of fics by the one author and I've enjoyed several and their email address is displayed in a prominent place.) But if I read the fic all the way through and I liked it and it's on LJ, then I'll comment, no problem. What I actually say depends on if there's anything I can single out about the story to remark upon. Also, if I can see that a lot of other people have said the same sort of things then I'll hold back or find something new to say, because I don't like being repetitive.
As far as leaving feedback, I am pretty bad at emailing comments too. Livejournal has definitely provided a more convenient setting for feedback (or at least a more familiar one at this point.) Although, I probably have a slightly bigger impetus to leave feedback since I pretty much rec everything I enjoyed enough to review, and I like to take a moment to let the author know that I've recced their story.
In general, with the right incentive, masses turn into immature, rude, malicious and irresponsible mob with prevalent attitude of entitlement to zillion things.
I don't write, don't do art and am in LJ just to have fun. I give feedback quite often -- I'd say in 80% or more? If I like the story I'll write immediately or days, weeks later if the story stayed in my mind. It's the only thanks I can give to the authors.
Sure, it's nice to get answer from the author back, but I don't really feel I'm entitled to get back a russian novel or even a thank you for each I loved the story OMG - so hot!! I comment with.
I much prefer author brainstorming for another story or delicious manipulation.
What I don't like is the selection to answering the comments to posts which are not story/art related. If a LJer is writing/discussing about a certain topics (i.e. enthusing over hotness of Clark Kent's biceps and six pack) and I give my deep insight, ahem (i.e. OMG - yes, you know how seeing that mak Lex nuts -- he sure wanted to fuck him right there on the spot) and I see that the LJer only answered the selective group of friends (possibly before and after my comment) -- and that is a consistent occurrence -- yeah, that bothers me big time. I don't comment anymore.
Also, I am not big fan of filtered posts where flaming of one person happens in a selected group. Yeah, we all like to gossip, but still it is in a way even more hurful and just as cowardly as anonymus wanking.
I much prefer author brainstorming for another story or delicious manipulation.
Entitlement of any sort is offputting to me, whether on the reader or writer ends of the scale. It seems like a lot of authors respond in kind to the feedback they get, with longer feedback leading to longer responses. I can't help but enjoy this, because it seems like it can definitely lead to een more discussion and sometimes new plot bunnies or tighter characterization and more creativity. I don't think any author has to respond to feedback, but it's always seemed the polite thing to do.
And a complete word to what you said about ljers picking and choosing who they respond to. It annoys me because if those are the only people they want to interact with, why don't they just set up filters and lock everything down to just those people? Why have an open journal if you're not actually interested in interacting with the people who read it?
In another discussion that sprung from this thread and that I can't find a link of at the moment, the OP said that s/he doesn't reply to feedbacks unless there is a question or something because s/he doesn't know what to say in response beside the blanket thank you and this s/he feel is an inadequate response.
That is a viewpoint I try to see when I noticed that a particular author doesn't respond to feedbacks, either that they are too modest, that they are unable to think of a response, or that they are overwhelmed by the amount of feedbacks and thus, couldn't reply to all of them, because the alternative? Well, it's not something I want to dwell on long, because it either reflects negatively on me or the author.
If the only interaction I have with someone is through feedback, and it continues to be completely one sided, how am I to know whether they have a reason for not responding to me? I think you are a lot nicer than me for giving them the benefit of the doubt, but I can't help but feel less than encouraged to continue interacting with them.
I always reply to feedback left on my stories, especially when they're left within a week of the story being posted. I tend to neglect responding to comments left on stories I posted months ago, which is not an excuse but more a case of forgetfulness.
My responses to feedback are proportional to the feedback left. If it's just "eeeee this was HOT!" I'd just say "Thanks!" My replies are based on what the person says, so I don't leave generic thanks responses but try to customize it to what the feedbacker remarked on in the original comment.
I agree that it's just politeness to reply to feedback. The hard facts are, most people DON'T leave feedback. Hell, I don't leave fb as often as I should either.
Regarding non-fic posts, I try to respond to as many comments as I can but I don't always do so especially if the comment is just a short one agreeing with what I said, or making a throwaway comment. I don't expect people to respond to every comment I make either, unless it's a discussion post asking a question and I left a long comment in response.
As a reader, I'm also far, far worse at leaving feedback for older stories than more recent ones. I think that's definitely a two way street for everyone.
I have a hard time responding to every comment on a non-fic post too. Probably the same way I have a hard time responding to every post that comes up on my friendslist. We're always going to be better at replying to a comment when we feel like we have something to add to the discussion. With feedback though, it seems a little more cut and dry. As you said, I think it does come down to politeness; most people respond to compliments by saying thank you, if they don't–and there's no obvious reason why they didn't–I can't help but assume that they're, for whatever reason, not interested in being complimented.
For all I know, they might have the email-notification turned off, in which case leaving feedback is essentially pointless, since the goal is to let the person know that you liked their stuff. Or, they read their feedback and just don't respond, which falls into my 'less than polite' box and if someone can't give me the courtesy of a 'thank-you', I'm not inclined to give them praise.
For one my math enabled brain says: but the exchange has been completed. I have just spent weeks and weeks writing this thing. And I wrote it because I wanted to yes, and I wrote it because it just would't let me go, yes. But I have put in my hours. And when I say hours. I mean months sometimes.
And so my feedback is a lovely little gift, it's great, yes it validates me on some level.
BUT. I can't help but do the cost/benefit analysis so to speak. Fandom has now made me feel obligated to reply to all feedback (not that I probably wouldn't in any event) and now I know that working on a story not only includes all of those before hours, but many *after* hours as well. And while a person who has just sent me feedback has invested the time it takes to read my story + the time it takes to write me feedback. Both of which can vary greatly, in most cases that investment is no where NEAR what I put in.
So I feel a little put upon to reply to all feedback in a manner in which no one will feel insulted. I too feel a copy and paste feedback is sort of... belittling the process and seriously, sometimes I just have no idea what to say. Whether it's this large, complimentary feedback (which often don't include questions to answer, which indeed does make it easer, but just this lovely letter to me about my story) or a one line "OMG! JKLJKLJK!!"
ALSO. And I remember this from another converstation. It's a matter of how exhausting a writer finds it. Some people have no problem with just plowing through a row of comments. I get a page done and I feel exhausted. It's not easy. At least for me. If you go and look at my fic LJ you'll see I've stopped in the middle because I need to step back and take a break. And then life gets busy and I forget for a little while. Some stories... I can't stand to look at when I'm done. I dont' want to think about it beyond checking in on the feedback now and then. So it can take upwards of a month to get back to it and do some serious replying.
I also chafe at the assumption a lot of people make that some authors don't reply to feedback because they think they're above it or that they're too good for it or something inane like that.
Exactly. I mean, I think we're all agreeing on the matter of etiquette and what's socially polite. But hi, *writing*. I don't demand feedback. I may plead for it, I appreciate it a whole lot even if it's just ":)" but I do not expect it. Why should anyone demand an answer to feedback from me?
I don't get why this isn't on the same level as "Finish this story now or else." Yes, that low.
Now again, I have to add the caveat that I'm very much about Story, Story, Story, even if it's to my *own* detriment to turn people off. One of the pleasures of fanfic for me is the freedom to write it and then not worry if anyone's buying it.
And with that in mind? Some stories take it out of me. The two stories in my collection of about 150 fics that receive the most feedback get no replies from me. Trefoil (http://shusu.livejournal.com/186185.html) got recced all over the place and got some two dozen spontaneous responses over three *years*. I feel horrible not being able to respond -- but I just couldn't. The next HP book had come out; the characters had gotten away from me, in canon and in my own fanon. I loved the stories, I loved the feedback, but the best I could do was make a graphic, and put it up right there: this is a special story, but I just -can't-.
If a potential commenter wants to take that as a personal slight on *them*, there's not much I can do about it. It's not like I don't have mini-novels like The River Sanzu Overflows or Digital Complex that receive little feedback outside of my flist... of course I treasure every comment for every story. A pro author would love every fan-letter and e-mail. But do we expect him or her to answer everything? (Are we going to expect David Hewlett to say something about his postcards?)
Not getting an answer doesn't stop me from leaving dozens more comments in stranger's journals for stories that are brilliant. As a reader, that's *my* burden to make the connection with the writer, then see what happens. The original wank, to me, just reeks of an excuse not to leave feedback. Period.
I seem to be leaving less and less feedback recently myself, though. It's got to the stage that the story has to be a piece of absolute brilliance, or I think it merits more comments than already given. Too often, I'll scroll through all the other comments and wonder what the hell it's possible to add. And I realise that's bad of me, considering how I feel about receiving feedback myself, however simple. Meh.
I think this probably works both ways. It's a rare person who responds to an older story in the first place. I for one, and pretty terrible at leaving feedback on older stories, and I've definitely noticed that when I do I get a much lower response rate to my feedback (somewhat of a vicious circle I guess.)
After all of this discussion, I think I might try to get better at leaving feedback more than I have been lately. I keep reccing stories and realising belatedly that I haven't left feedback to the story itself.
Does anyone think a blanketed thank you is a poor response to feedback?
I think, if someone has taken the time to give a long, thoughtful response, then it's - maybe not exactly rude, but it's certainly not exactly polite, either. Although, from a personal point of view, it still feels better than not responding at all.
And, if you've got 20 comments all saying, 'Great story.' then it's fine as a blanket response. I think *not* to respond with anything is worse. I mean, sure, it's not always fun posting that over and over, but it's often not particularly time consuming, and it acknowledges the feedbacker, you know? If a writer doesn't do that, then I think the chance for a more meaningful dialogue later on is reduced, as well.
I've seen the 'fan fic is a gift, and therefore the author doesn't need to respond,' argument, but most authors I know of (myself included) really want feedback. That's why the majority of authors post to the internet, rather than finishing a story and leaving it on the harddrive. It's why we have betas, rather than just posting it, because we want to know there's an audience there, that someone, somewhere, likes what we wrote. And if someone tells us that -- and I know it often makes my day -- then why not respond?
And even if that's not the case and that's not why you post, if someone gives me a gift and I say thank you (which, as I understand it, is what feedback is in this situation) I generally expect some kind of response from the gift giver. 'Your welcome,' or whatever. If I said thank you in rl and was met with silence, I'd be bemused, so that argument doesn't really work for me, though I can see where it comes from.
And if nothing else, fandom needs the dialogue, imo. It stops working when that goes, 'cause otherwise we might as well be just reading the books and talking to ourselves.
I dunno. Maybe it depends how you started. My first experience of LJ was through people who always responded to comments, whether fic related or not, so not doing that seems weird to me. If you start out differently, then maybe that's not how you (generic) see it. And as with just about everything in fandom, mileage varies. Hugely, much of the time. *g*
Yes!
And if nothing else, fandom needs the dialogue, imo. It stops working when that goes, 'cause otherwise we might as well be just reading the books and talking to ourselves.
And yes again! I've seen so many interesting discussions and even more stories come out of feedback threads, and I know not every author is interested in engaging on that level, but having some sort of open channel of dialogue is just so much better. I certainly don't have any authority over how an author responds to their feedback, but I can't help but be disappointed and a little put off when they don't. Some sort of aknowlegement when you recieve a compliment has always seemed pretty standard to me.
This is one of my great insane guilts in fandom. I try, I try so hard, but I always forget someone and then look up and it's two weeks later and there are ten comments I haven't responded to--and sometimes they're intelligent, well-reasoned, extremely flattering comments!--and I would feel like such an idiot responding to them two weeks (or...a month...or more...) after the fact.
I actually just kind of suck at responding to comments in general. I think it's something to do with being a really aggressive introvert, not that that's an excuse--for some reason, it just seems to take a lot of energy. Or maybe it's just that I'm lazy. But again, I feel reeeeeeaally guilty about it.
I do think that people should respond to feedback, but God, I know how much time and effort it takes me, and I know that I adore every comment whether I manage to respond to it or not (most of them! I respond to most of them! almost all, even!) so I don't hold it against the authors who don't. That said, I do appreciate it when authors respond to my comments, especially if it's something thoughtful, although God knows I've left enough "OMG GREAT STORY YOU KILLED ME" comments that really can't be responded to thoughtfully.
So, yes. Anyone out there who has posted a long involved comment to a story of mine and not gotten a response: I sincerely, sincerely, apologize, and I can guarantee that I read it and loved it.
I've seen that too. I don't, hmmm I don't like, keep a list of people I've feedbacked and check off whether I recieve a response from them or not. But if I leave someone feedback often enough and never hear a word from them, chances are I'll start noticing the pattern and without anything else to go by, I'm pretty much left to assume that they're not interested in encouraging reader response.
As for hating someone over fandom stuff, well, it just seems petty. Fandom is supposed to be fun, a source of entertainment and enthusiasm. If you're not feeling it, to the point of vicious anger at specific people, that's what the scroll feature is for. Someone else said this and I agree with it: a lot of people use the anonymous thing as a way to disguise what most people would normally call stupidity. If I were to say, deadly serious, I hate everyone who ships Harry/Draco because I like Harry/Snape and everyone who doesn't write it SUCKS and you should all hate them too! I think people would, rightly, call me on being stupid.
As a writer, these are tricky questions for me because I'm both massively lazy and because I really feel like I should answer every piece of feedback. There have been times when I've been sick and away from my computer for a few days after posting a story that I've had to post and say "thank you everyone for all the great feedback and I'm really sorry I couldn't answer it all." And then I feel guilty. *sheepish grin*
Usually, however, I answer my feedback. I'm only a moderately known writer in my fandom and maybe a little more known in my pairing, so it's not like I get pages and pages of feedback. If the person actually says something more than "this was great" or "zomg so hot!" I'll try to reply to their comments. If that's all I get, I'll still thank them or say I'm glad they liked the fic. In fact I probably use that last phrase more than I should, but hopefully my readers know that I mean it, that I genuinely am glad people like what I write.
But then I'm a housewife and while that does entail work, I also have a lot of faffing about time. Back when I was working, I was posting fic on mailing lists and I'd do the blanket feedback thing simply because I had a job involving massive amounts of over time, part time step-kids, a wife and never ever enough hours in the day to myself.
As a reader? I honestly don't care if the author responds to my feedback, unless it's really detailed and I *ask a question*. Mostly I feel that if they owe me anything at all, they've already done their duty by providing me with entertainment and I'm *thanking* them for that by giving them feedback. They've already given me what I want. I don't need to be singled out and given their attention as well.
I don't practice this with responses to my own writing, though, so I'm not sure how strongly I believe that authors don't owe their readers anything that they haven't already given. Or maybe it's that I'm just bowing to the expectations and wants of others to avoid pissing people off. I do know for sure that as a reader I'm thankful for the story and expecting anything else just seems greedy, imho. Especially when it brings writers beyond their comfort zone, if they feel stupid responding to fifty comments with the same line and it wipes them out to think of something new and original to say to each of those fifty or more comments.
I'd rather they write another story than reply to me with something witty.
That's an interesting way of looking at it. Sort of like if someone did something nice for you IRL and you gave them flowers as a thankyou, you wouldn't expect them to give you flowers as a thankyou for the thankyou flowers, would you? I think feedback is more complicated than just being a "thanks for giving me this fanwork" acknowledgement (and I personally prefer feedback that is constructive or at least tells me why a person liked something, rather than just saying "this is cool, thanks"), but if you look at feedback as a thankyou...you don't need to thank someone for thanking you :-/ (then again, saying "you're welcome" is usually considered polite, so...I don't know!)
yeah, sometimes I feel like all I did was leave 40 "thanks" replies, but it really depends on what people have said. if I am getting longer, more in depth comments, I tend to reply in kind, whereas the "wow, great fic" comments just get a quick thanks. I don't know if my fics are typical. Most of them get around 20 comments, the longer ones have 75-100. It really isn't that time consuming to reply to them since they don't come all at once, so I do it.
I tend to leave feedback whenever something really floats my boat and I don't care if the author responds. Okay, maybe if I really left a really long in-depth one, but that's rare as it is and tends to be for people I kind of know anyway.
I don't know what the ratio on LJ is of readers versus those who comment. On many of the fanfic archives I use, it looks like about 100 readers per one comment. LJ Iexpect may be a lower ration than that, just because commenting is such a big part of participating in the fandom(s), but I which I had some stats on it.
It seems like this is the standard that a lot of authors keep to. I think if I were fandom's miss manners I would probably recommend that a friendly author interested in maintaining an open connection to their readers follow those guidelines when responding to feedback unless they honestly don't have the time, in which case some sort of response is still preferential to no response at all.
In terms of the ratio of commenters to readers, I suspect that, while higher (or is it lower? I hate ratios) on livejournal, simply due to the ease of leaving a quick comment and the reasonable suspicion that it will be seen by the author, it's still a lot closer to 100 to 1 than anything else.
If I really want to praise a story, I do it so the author will know someone liked his/her story and maybe, possibly write more. I don't do it so that I'll be somehow recognized by the author.
I don't think it's a waste of time for authors to thank for feedback, though. If the author is really grateful for the feedback, why not? But if the author doesn't have time to post "thank you" a million times, I don't have a problem with that either.
As a (very occasional) writer, I do try to thank people for feedback, but I always feel so intimidated by my own feedback, and never know what to say.
As for those who insist on more than a 'thank you', it depends entirely on the kind of fb left. I know that I try to always respond to whatever the comment pinpoints and thank the reader for their attention. If one leaves a comment reading "Great story. Love it. Write more." there is nothing wrong with a simple thank you. If the responder goes into more detail, again, it is only polite to respond in kind. Follow the basic rules of writing thank you letters for gifts and one cannot go wrong, because fb is a gift and if a writer thinks themselves above such simple courtesy....there are less polite words for that. No fanfic author is so enormous that he/she cannot take the time to respond to a comment and if one thinks he/she is that important or above common courtesy, I respectfully submit that said person is sadly lacking and in dire need of a little humility.
Honestly, the fact that this is even a debate is appalling.
I do respond to all feedback comments I get on my stories. Sometimes it's a brief "Thanks," especially if the comment itself was brief. It might take me a while if I'm busy or there were a lot of comments, but eventually I get to all of them. I do this because it's how I was raised -- if someone says something nice to you, you say thanks or smile or acknowledge it in some way. NOT doing so goes against everything ingrained in my head about basic graciousness; but more importantly, telling someone that I loved what they made makes ME happy, so it's what I do.
I GIVE feedback on stories I like. Sometimes it's one word, sometimes it's ten paragraphs. That depends on what feelings the fic inspires in me and how receptive to my thoughts I think the author might be.
Sometimes these writers NEVER respond to feedback and I know that when I post my comment. That tends to make me less verbose in my comment, since I know they won't engage me in discussion anyway and I have other things to do. But it's still important to me to post my appreciation of their creation, so I do.
As far as expectations...as much as I love receiving comments on my stories, I try really, really hard not to expect them. I don't believe any writer is entitled to praise. If it happens, then that's lovely and I'm grateful, but I don't have any right to demand people tell me they love me.
As far as other writers replying to my feedback comments on fic...I appreciate the gesture when they do. If they have time to reply in detail, that's wonderful. But I appreciate that just as much as someone taking time to copy and paste "Thanks!" seventy-five times in a row. We all have lives and responsibilities that consume our time. Taking a moment away from that to acknowledge me is a kindness, and I appreciate it.
Do I expect it? Not really, but that's more of a world-view thing on my part. I don't want to rest my happiness on whether a total stranger is able or willing to answer their fanmail. If they do, great -- I genuinely appreciate it. But if they don't, oh well.
Before this post I really hadn't thought much more than that I think it's polite to respond to the fedback you get, although I've never expected that all authors will have either the time on inclination to do so. 120 comments later, I still think it's more favorable to respond to feedback, but I think the reason why has changed. While I will always believe that saying thank you and you're welcome are completely warranted in all exchanges (of compliments, gifts, or whatever other analogy one might apply to feedback,) responding to feedback isn't just about being polite, it's also about ackowledgment. Most readers are just that, readers. And while a lot of them try to take on other fannish activities, on the whole, readers are always going to feel like second class citizens in a culture built around the ability to write (and vid and draw, etc.) Livejournal is based around written communication and a system of comments, replies, and counter-replies. When an author consistently fails to acknowledge their readers it frustrates me and it disappoints me.
Not all writers are going to have time to reply to all of their comments and keep communication going. And that's fine with me. But I think even then, it's far more preferable for them to address their lack of reply in some manner than it is for them to ignore the issue entirely. If the sga_hate meme was anything to go by, silence, in this case, breeds contempt. I don't think a lack of response to my feedback is a personal slight. I'm never going to go around saying I hate _____ because they didn't respond to meeeeeee! I'm never going to start keeping track of whether or not an author replies to my feedback, but if I start to notice the habit, I'm probably always going to be less inclined to leave them detailed feedback in the future.
Personally, I would prefer my favorite authors spend their often limited free time writing more stories, but I'm greedy that way. ;)
If that's what it is actually coming down to, I would too. But I will always think that in a community based on back and forth communication, an author's complete lack of ackowledgment, in any manner, of their readers is poor grace.
This is a subject on which I could, and have, ranted several times :-), I've even ran polls on the subject.
I do believe that all feedback should be responded to, and also that in a forum like LJ where people aren't getting individual messages (as they do on mailing lists) that yes, they should take the time to say something, even if it does mean them saying 'thank you 40 times.' It's only polite. After all, those 40 people have gone to the trouble of leaving a comment, I firmly believe the author should respond.
As for whether the lack of response stops you leaving comments, sending LoCs, most definitely yes. When I first got into fandom I regularly wrote long LoCs to authors. A good proportion responded, some in depth, some with a simple 'thank you', but several didn't. I'm all for giving people a second even third chance, but when the people (and I hate to say it but they were quite often one of 'the' names) didn't bother to reply; I didn't bother sending any more. And this did have a knock on effect for other people. I basically stopped sending them.
On LJ I do leave feedback, generally nothing detailed, just a quick note and pretty much 98% of the time I get a response. From those I don't? Simple, they get a second chance, then I just don't bother any more.
I have heard people say 'oh, but if the person has written you a really long LoC, they don't want a simple thank you, they expect a full response'. Nope, not true. A simple 'thank you' is more than enough. I've also heard it said 'we're too busy writing the stories you love so much, we don't have time to reply'. Rubbish! Of course they do, how long does it take to say 'thank you.'
I have also heard it say that LoCs/feedback are like gifts to the author, fine, I pretty much agree, but... Well I always say 'thank you' for gifts, so again I expect a reply.
I always say thank you, no matter how many times I have to say it. And I always do it individually.
I refuse to beleive that anyone who has the time to participate in fandom doesn't have time to say thank you at least once. If I were to create a scale of preferential responces to feedback, blanket thanks yous wouldn't be at the top of it, but the cliché that something is better than nothing seems to apply to the acknowledgment of feedback. Good grace will never go out of style and I will always find a writer who takes the time to acknowledge their readers to be more classy than one who doesn't ever take that time.
The thing is, I just can't. I mean, literally, I don't have enough time on the internet to do it. Not even with just a form, "Thanks." Not if I want to keep reccing, reading, moderating, etc, etc. But I do love to *get* feedback, so yeah, I feel guilty about the ones I don't have time to respond to.
I'm always afraid my silence will come across as deliberate snobbery. And whenever I try to explain myself, it feels like I'm complaining, subtly, that I get too many comments and it's SUCH A BURDEN, and that's so totally *not* it! I like engaging my readers. I download comments and read them offline so that I can give them my full attention. I try to answer as many as I can. I just... I can't keep up. :(
There are always exceptions, of course - it's ridiculously easy to miss a comment on LJ, even with the email feature on, or to think that you'll go back when you have more time and then forget. I don't even mind blanket thanks from the author, especially if all I've left if a one-line note saying 'I liked it - good work' or whatever. And if the only problem is time - why not say so? Everyone can relate to RL pressures and lack of internet time, and I think a little communication would go a long way to addressing the misconceptions between authors and reviewers.
Anyway, the real reason I wrote this is that I think reader's get part of their expectation of replies from the attitudes of a lot of author's - the 'I wrote this out of the goodness of my heart, now you owe me many reviews'. It's so easy to turn that around - 'I reviewed this out of the goodness of my heart, now you owe me many thanks.' Which, to me, is just faulty logic no matter who is saying it.
For that matter, the 'I don't have time to respond to feedback' also works both ways. While an author spends a lot of time on their fic, reader's generally aren't just reading that one story. The demands on their internet time could be just as high, so priotising of fics to review is just as valid as prioritising of feedback to respond to.
Right, so I'm starting to get off topic here, but it was just a few points I wanted to throw into the discussion.
I feel the same way. It certainly seems like silence, in this case, breeds contempt and that a little bit of acknowledgment will go a long way towards stopping that from happening.
In terms of expectations, fannish entitlement on either side of the reader/writer fence bothers me. I don't expect every author to respond to every piece of feedback I leave, but if they do it's going to go a long way towards encouraging me to leave more feedback for them in the future. ANd if, on a consistent basis, I notice an author not acknowledging their feedback at all, that's going to go a long way towards discouraging me to leave them feedback in the future. And I don't think there's anything wrong with that attitude. I read more fanfic than I have time to write detailed feedback on. And I'd rather spend the time giving it to someone who I know will appreciate it than to someone who never responds at all.